هل فعلا العلامة ترتليان بعد هرطقته ذكر ان مريم العذراء لها اولاد ؟؟
لاتاكد من هذه المعلومة بحثت كثيرا فيما كتب عن العلامة ترتليان وأيضا بحث في أقواله
فوجدت ما يقال عنه هو التالي
كتاب العلامة ترتليان، من آباء أفريقيا - القمص أثناسيوس فهمي جورج
في اهتمامه بالدفاع عن الناسوت الحقيقي للمسيح، أكد ترتليان على أن جسد رب المجد لم يكن جسداً سمائياً لكنه ولد حقاً من جسد السيدة العذراء، لدرجة أنه يرفض عقيدة دوام بتولية السيدة العذراء في الميلاد وبعد الميلاد، وهنا كان انحرافه الفكري والإيماني إذ يقول "رغم أنها كانت عذراء عندما حبلت به، لكنها كانت زوجة عندما ولدته".
ومريم العذراء بالنسبة لترتليان هي حواء الثانية، فبينما كانت حواء الأولى لا تزال عذراء، تسللت كلمة الشرير إلى أذنيها ونتج عنها الموت، كذلك كان لابد أن كلمة الله يحل في نفس عذراء ليقيم الحياة، لكي ما أفسده هذا الجنس (المرأة) يخلص عن طريق هذا الجنس عينه أيضاً، وكما صدقت حواء الحية، كذلك أمنت مريم بما قاله لها الملاك.
ورغم ان هذا لو صحيح فهو أخطأ فكريا بوضوح.
ولكن الحقيقة مع كل احترام بالطبع لهذا الفكر وقائلينه الذي اعتقد انهم فقط تناقلوه عن بعض الكتاب الغربيين المتحررين. الا أنى عندما بحثت في اقوال العلامة ترتليان كلها بكل اجزائها في
Volume III. Latin Christianity: Its Founder, Tertullian
Three Parts: I. Apologetic; II. Anti-Marcion; III. Ethical
Volume IV. The Fathers of the Third Century
Tertullian Part IV; Minucius Felix; Commodian;
لم أجد هذا الكلام على الاطلاق بل وجدت عكسه بوضوح وان كل كلام العلامة ترتليان عن مريم العذراء هو استمرار بتوليتها قبل وبعد ميلاده بل في بعض الفصول يشرح هذا بالتفصيل مؤكدا انه حتمية بقاءها عذراء لأجل نبوة إشعياء بل يرد على اليهود بقوة في ادعاء انها شابة مؤكدا ان إشعياء يقول عذراء وأيضا يرد على ماركيون الهرطوقي في هذا
بل وأكثر من هذا وجدت ان أستاذ الابائيات فليب شاف يؤكد ذلك أيضا
وبحثت في الشاهد الذي قيل في بعض الأماكن ان قال هذا في
Against Marcion, 4:19
ولم اجد أي شيء من هذا في الكتاب الرابع الفصل 19
Chapter XIX.—The Rich Women of Piety Who Followed Jesus Christ’s Teaching by Parables. The Marcionite Cavil Derived from Christ’s Remark, When Told of His Mother and His Brethren. Explanation of Christ’s Apparent Rejection Them.
بل وتعبير بالحقيقة امه واخوته هو لا ينكر انهم أبناء عمومته
which might have satisfied their inquiry respecting the family and descent of Christ. Such a method of testing the point had therefore no consistency whatever in it and they “who were standing without” were really “His mother and His brethren.” It remains for us to examine His meaning when He resorts to non-literal4207 words, saying “Who is my mother or my brethren?” It seems as if His language amounted to a denial of His family and His birth; but it arose actually from the absolute nature of the case, and the conditional sense in which His words were to be explained.
بل هذا التعبير الذي كان يستخدم على أبناء العم او الخال في وقته انهم اخوة
فلفظ really هو يتكلم به عن امه مريم العذراء ولا يقول ان مريم انجبت بعد ميلاده
بل كما قلت هو قال عكس هذا بوضوح وامثلة فقط مما قاله مؤكدا دوام بتولية مريم العذراء
Chapter IX.--Of the Prophecies of the Birth and Achievements of Christ.
Begin we, therefore, to prove that the Birth of Christ was announced by prophets; as Isaiah (e.g.,) foretells, "Hear ye, house of David; no petty contest have ye with men, since God is proposing a struggle.
Therefore God Himself will give you a sign; Behold, the virgin  shall conceive, and bear a son, and ye shall call his name Emmanuel"
Well, then, Isaiah foretells that it behoves Him to be called Emmanuel; and that subsequently He is to take the power of Damascus and the spoils of Samaria, in opposition to the king of the Assyrians. "Now," say they, "that (Christ) of yours, who is come, neither was called by that name, nor engaged in warfare." But we, on the contrary, have thought they ought to be admonished to recall to mind the context of this passage as well. For subjoined is withal the interpretation of Emmanuel--"God with us"  --in order that you may regard not the sound only of the name, but the sense too. For the Hebrew sound, which is Emmanuel, has an interpretation, which is, God with us. Inquire, then, whether this speech, "God with us" (which is Emmanuel), be commonly applied to Christ ever since Christ's light has dawned, and I think you will not deny it. For they who out of Judaism believe in Christ, ever since their believing on Him, do, whenever they shall wish to say  Emmanuel, signify that God is with us: and thus it is agreed that He who was ever predicted as Emmanuel is already come, because that which Emmanuel signifies is come--that is, "God with us." Equally are they led by the sound of the name when they so understand "the power of Damascus," and "the spoils of Samaria," and "the kingdom of the Assyrians," as if they portended Christ as a warrior; not observing that Scripture premises, "since, ere the child learn to call father or mother, he shall receive the power of Damascus and the spoils of Samaria, in opposition to the king of the Assyrians." For the first step is to look at the demonstration of His age, to see whether the age there indicated can possibly exhibit the Christ as already a man, not to say a general. Forsooth, by His babyish cry the infant would summon men to arms, and would give the signal of war not with clarion, but with rattle, and point out the foe, not from His charger's back or from a rampart, but from the back or neck of His suckler and nurse, and thus subdue Damascus and Samaria in place of the breast. (It is another matter if, among you, infants rush out into battle,--oiled first, I suppose, to dry in the sun, and then armed with satchels and rationed on butter,--who are to know how to lance sooner than how to lacerate the bosom!)  Certainly, if nature nowhere allows this,--(namely,) to serve as a soldier before developing into manhood, to take "the power of Damascus" before knowing your father,--it follows that the pronouncement is visibly figurative. "But again," say they, "nature suffers not a `virgin' to be a parent; and yet the prophet must be believed." And deservedly so; for he bespoke credit for a thing incredible, by saying that it was to be a sign. "Therefore," he says, "shall a sign be given you. Behold, a virgin shall conceive in womb, and bear a son." But a sign from God, unless it had consisted in some portentous novelty, would not have appeared a sign. In a word, if, when you are anxious to cast any down from (a belief in) this divine prediction, or to convert whoever are simple, you have the audacity to lie, as if the Scripture contained (the announcement), that not "a virgin," but "a young female," was to conceive and bring forth; you are refuted even by this fact, that a daily occurrence--the pregnancy and parturition of a young female, namely--cannot possibly seem anything of a sign. And the setting before us, then, of a virgin-mother is deservedly believed to be a sign;
Chapter XIII.--Argument from the Destruction of Jerusalem and
Desolation of Judea. out of which man was of yore first formed, out of which now Christ through the flesh has been born of a virgin;
who shall declare?" Because no one at all of human beings was conscious of the nativity of Christ at His conception, when as the Virgin Mary was found pregnant by the word of God; and because His life was to be taken from the land."
Chapter IV.--The Next Stage Occurs in the Creation of Man by the
Eternal Word. Spiritual as Well as Physical Gifts to Man. The Blessings of Man's Free-Will. For the Virgin Mary gave birth to Christ, the Saviour of men; and the virgin mother the Church, the spouse of Christ, gives birth to Christians
Chapter XIII.--Isaiah's Prophecies Considered. The Virginity of Christ's Mother a Sign. Other Prophecies Also Signs. Metaphorical Sense of Proper Names in Sundry Passages of the Prophets.
A virgin mother is justly deemed to be proposed  by God as a sign,
Chapter XX.  --The Subsequent Influence of Christ's Death in the
World Predicted. The Sure Mercies of David. What These are.
Indeed, you will be obliged from these words all the more to understand that Christ is reckoned to spring from David by carnal descent, by reason of His birth  of the Virgin Mary.
Chapter X.--Further Proofs of the Same Truth in the Same Chapter, from the Healing of the Paralytic, and from the Designation Son of Man Which Jesus Gives Himself. Tertullian Sustains His Argument by Several Quotations from the Prophets.
If He is not of a human father, it follows that He must be (the son) of a human mother. If of a human mother, it is evident that she must be a virgin. For to whom a human father is not ascribed, to his mother a husband will not be reckoned;
Now, if this distinction be observed, that is to say, if He be Son of man as born of His mother, because not begotten of a father, and His mother be a virgin, because His father is not human--He will be that Christ whom Isaiah foretold that a virgin should conceive,
وقدمت باختصار لانه شرح كثيرا هذا الامر وكرر كثيرا دوام بتولية العذراء
بل كما قلت حتى تعليق عالم الابائيات فليب شاف يؤكد ذلك
Tertullian seems with reflect the early view of the church as to our
Lord's total abnegation of all filial relations with the Virgin, when
He gave to her St. John, instead of Himself, on the Cross.
وحتى في الوكيبيديا تحت عنوان
According to Irenaeus, Christ, being born out of the Virgin Mary, created a totally new historical situation. This view influenced Ambrose of Milan and Tertullian, who wrote about the virginal conception of the Mother of God.
ولم أجد عكس ذلك في أي من كتابات العلامة ترتليانوس.
ولكن لا الغي احتمالية ان يكون له كتابات أخرى قال فيها ذلك ولكن حتى اجدها وأتأكد انه قال هذا من نص كلامه. الان اظل أؤكد ان العلامة ترتليان لم يقل ذلك قبل او بعد سقوطه في الهرطقة بل قال عكس ذلك ومثله مثل كثير من الإباء أكدوا بتولية العذراء
وسأحاول أكمل البحث في هذا الامر ولو وجدت شيء مختلف سأقدمه لاحقا
والمجد لله دائما